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  • It has been brought to my attention that some (many?) of you have problems with the wiki's administration (the way it's being run, or even the administrators themselves).

    First, I'd like to apologize on behalf of the admins. It's our job to make sure your experience is as smooth as possible, and, if we have failed in that regard, we apologize. You are not to blame for any mistakes we have made.

    Second, I'd like you to speak to one of the admins about any and all problems you might be having. If you don't want to discuss it publicly, you are, of course, free to ask one (or more) of us to the chat and have a private discussion with an admin of your choosing. If you wish to remain anonymous, our collective email (ben10planetsysops@gmail.com) is always open. However, note that your message will be visible to all admins.

    It is important that you share any concerns you might have, so that we can improve this wiki. Your opinions do matter, even if it may not seem like it sometimes.

    On a personal note, since I've been the most active admin for a while now, it stands to reason that I'm the one who committed most - perhaps even all - of these mistakes. And for that, I'm sorry.

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    • As far as I'm concerned, I don't see any current problems with the admins. I know that you guys always do your best and try to help this wiki when possible. I can't say that you guys haven't made a single mistake since you've been on this wiki because everyone makes mistakes, but I can say that you're a very supportive team.

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    • I don't see any problems neither, this wiki is a damn sight more fair than the Robot Wars wiki and is a friendly wiki where admins don't sweep problems under the table for a quiet life.

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    • I too don't have any problem. I think that it's way better than other wikis. At first I thought that the blocking system was most unfair, especially at the moment when you're gonna earn a 'devoted' or 'dedicated' badge (It takes quite a lot of paitence for that) but eventually I realised that I did make a few mistakes.

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    • I don't see any problems with the Wiki at all.

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    • Things Blaziken didn't mention and most users don't notice:

      • We have 7 admins and 3 are inactive
      • Not many users liked that an admin was spamming for badges and didn't get a warning http://prntscr.com/83u5gc
      • Only one admin monitors the threads and custodians lost their ability to remove warnings
      • Vandals get too many second chances and that leaves other users correcting their edits and warning them
      • It seems like every problem is redirected towards Blaziken
      • Admins are often not around, they should try to be around more often if they're administering a wiki
      • Whenever I ask them to help with editing stuff, it's either not working out, or I just end up asking other users to help me because of time
      • Not all admins speak English that well (out of the 7)
      • They sometimes make important theme changes before asking users' opinion

      These are just the main reasons and just for the record, these were all told to me. There were stuff they told me that I didn't agree with, those are not here. Think what you want, these are facts.

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    • Clearing up a few misunderstandings/misconceptions:

      • There are "only" five admins. The user list is unreliable to check activity (for instance, it says my last login was in July, but my last edit was today); however, taking it at its word, we've all edited and/or logged in some time in these past two days, with the exception of Cokedragon, who logged in eleven days ago. Again, the user list is unreliable for the purposes of checking for activity
      • Custodians losing their ability to remove threads is not on us. That was Wikia's doing. As far as I know, everyone who's not an admin or higher lost that ability
      • Don't conflate "not editing" with "not being around". I don't always edit, but I try to keep an eye on things with a program I have
      • Asking any small group for help is bound to have bad results. We (admins) are older than the majority of users, and thus have different (and more) responsibilities than you. We try to be here and maintain things from the administrative side, but we can't spend time we don't have to edit hundreds or thousands of articles. You'll notice how replacing templates with flags took a while, and there's a reason for that: I had other things that needed to be done. Getting a bot will help us in that regard
      • We have made no theme changes. Again, that was Wikia's doing. We don't make changes like that as we please
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      1. Alright, although it works well with other user groups.
      2. Who said it was on you? The emphasis was on the Only one admin part.
      3. There are other admins. You can't tell the difference when they are or not around.
      4. Regular users are around more than you guys. If you don't have the time, don't retain that high of a place on the wiki.
      5. Superbike changed the wiki's background many times without asking or telling first. Also, when my link color suggestion got approved, he changed it to a different color immediately without saying a word.
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      1. I can't explain it. It's probably a bug
      2. That may actually be partially my fault, in a way. The fact that I usually take care of warnings and such may have led users and my fellow admins to expect that of me. We are, after all, human
      3. That's an issue we'll work on
      4. This just proves you didn't read what I wrote. I said we didn't have time to edit hundreds or thousands of articles, but we maintain the wiki from the administrative side
      5. To which background change are you referring to? Some had the approval of admins, before we had the Suggestion system, and others were very minor, like making the background darker or lighter. As for the link colors, what exactly do you mean?
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    • Me and Oneofthosedf had different ideas about link colors and I wanted do to a test. I do however make a change to the wordmark for december or feburuary on Dwayne Mcduffie

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    • Superbike10 wrote: Me and Oneofthosedf had different ideas about link colors and I wanted do to a test.

      Then couldn't you just test it out on another wiki or by simply replacing one link with a different color, like this?

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    • Ylimegirl is right, Superbike10. You can't do something like that without community approval.

      Ylimegirl, I'm removing that example, if you wouldn't mind. That color hurts my eyes.

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    • Ylimegirl wrote:

      Superbike10 wrote: Me and Oneofthosedf had different ideas about link colors and I wanted do to a test.

      Then couldn't you just test it out on another wiki or by simply replacing one link with a different color, like this?

      I can do something like that.

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    • Blaziken rjcf wrote: Ylimegirl is right, Superbike10. You can't do something like that without community approval.

      Ylimegirl, I'm removing that example, if you wouldn't mind. That color hurts my eyes.

      I do mind, in fact. Please don't. There should be no reason to edit another user's messages unless it says something crude or mean. Don't edit just because you dislike a color used in an example.

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    • 4. This proves nothing. You obviously don't have the time to edit hundreds or thousands of articles. Not even I have that much time (a day, I suppose you are talking abut a day as well) Again, there is 5 of you.

      5. Yeah, a test. One user who opposed the change said it was too bright, so Superbike changed it. Fortunately, he changed them back after I got a mini a heart attack of it. (I see this one got closed by the time I posted this)

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:

      5. Yeah, a test. One user who opposed the change said it was too bright, so Superbike changed it. Fortunately, he changed them back after I got a mini a heart attack of it. (I see this one got closed by the time I posted this)

      I did however worked to accomodate all users.

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    • Ylimegirl wrote:

      Blaziken rjcf wrote: Ylimegirl is right, Superbike10. You can't do something like that without community approval.

      Ylimegirl, I'm removing that example, if you wouldn't mind. That color hurts my eyes.

      I do mind, in fact. Please don't. There should be no reason to edit another user's messages unless it says something crude or mean. Don't edit just because you dislike a color used in an example.

      It has nothing to do with disliking the color. The contrast literally makes my eyes hurt.

      @Oneofthosedf:

      I used to edit hundreds of articles per day, just as you do now.

      Although I oppose the idea of testing his idea in that manner, he reverted it in the end. No permanent theme change.

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    • Blaziken rjcf wrote:

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      I do mind, in fact. Please don't. There should be no reason to edit another user's messages unless it says something crude or mean. Don't edit just because you dislike a color used in an example.

      It has nothing to do with disliking the color. The contrast literally makes my eyes hurt.

      @Oneofthosedf:

      I used to edit hundreds of articles per day, just as you do now.

      Although I oppose the idea of testing his idea in that manner, he reverted it in the end. No permanent theme change.

      Then don't look at it! I don't edit other people's userpages because it makes my eyes hurt. You should not abuse admin privileges just because something mildly annoys you.

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    • Ylimegirl wrote:

      Then don't look at it! I don't edit other people's userpages because it makes my eyes hurt.

      Difference is, this is in a public thread that I have to post in, but whatever.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      You should not abuse admin privileges just because something mildly annoys you.

      I'm not sure you're getting what I'm saying. I feel physical pain in my eyes every time that link is in my field of vision. If you don't care, just say so.

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    • You said that many times. Still doesn't change a thing, as it doesn't seem you picked up this habit again. Also, you didn't do that kind of editing since I'm here.

      "No permanent change made", doesn't change the facts and that it wasn't done for the first time. I'm done with this theme changing topic as I think everything was said about it.

      If other admins see this, it would be a good time joining this and say something. If you don't, I'll assume you didn't see it and not that you don't want to comment. (just to clarify this)

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:

      You said that many times. Still doesn't change a thing, as it doesn't seem you picked up this habit again. Also, you didn't do that kind of editing since I'm here.

      Both true points, and there's a reason for them:

      When I'm not in college, I'm studying. When I'm not studying, I'm helping with family issues or doing daily chores. When I'm not doing any of the above, I'm traveling to or from somewhere. Finally, when I have time for myself, I'm trying to decompress. Even so, I find time to chat with whoever requests it, for as long as they want, check recent edits for vandalism, and be a part of Wikia's Community Council (mainly for the sake of this wiki, I might add).

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      "No permanent change made", doesn't change the facts

      Like I said, I don't approve of what was done.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      and that it wasn't done for the first time.

      Examples?

      On a personal note, you might want to consider who you're speaking with. Not a user named "Blaziken rjcf", not a bunch of cybernetic entities collectively known as "administrators", but real-life, flesh-and-blood, bona fide human beings. I started this thread in a spirit of humility and compassion, trying to improve your (users') experience, myself, and this wiki, yet I have received little more than scorn from you (flat-out ignoring what I'm saying on some issues, not to mention the, frankly manipulative, assumption) and Ylimegirl (flat-out dismissing my physical pain and being rude about it), who were the only ones to come forth and speak about the issues of this wiki.

      The other users who posted in this thread support the way the wiki is being run, while still acknowledging us as humans who sometimes make mistakes, and not some kind of entities that believe they are not to be questioned. While I don't think that every single action we have ever taken had good results (because it's simply not true), the idea that every single mistake we have ever made is proof of our incompetence or "unworthiness" as admins or whatever is absurd. I have agreed with you on several issues, tried to clear up the others, and continued to engage in a polite discussion, in spite of your apparent disdain for us (admins). I have already proposed measures for one of the issues you mentioned (I didn't propose them to you, but that's beside the point), and am thinking of potential fixes for other issues.

      You (Oneofthosedf) treat us (admins) as if we claim to be infallible, which we do not, or as if you know what our lives are like and what we do for this wiki, which you don't. I suggest you ask someone else who agrees with these issues to discuss them, assuming they're capable of keeping their impartiality, as I have been doing thus far.

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    • When I'm not in college, I'm studying. When I'm not studying, I'm helping with family issues or doing daily chores. When I'm not doing any of the above, I'm traveling to or from somewhere. Finally, when I have time for myself, I'm trying to decompress. Even so, I find time to chat with whoever requests it, for as long as they want, check recent edits for vandalism, and be a part of Wikia's Community Council (mainly for the sake of this wiki, I might add).

      If you truly do not have that much free time, you should not be administrating a wiki. Step down from this role if you are that busy.

      And I was not trying to ignore your "physical pain", which seems little more than an eyesore for you. I was just saying that using your power to edit other people's posts, simply to change the color of a word that was used an as an example that only seems to bother you, seems rather like an abuse of power. Just saying.

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    • Ylimegirl wrote:

      If you truly do not have that much free time, you should not be administrating a wiki. Step down from this role if you are that busy.

      I have time to administrate, which is the whole point of being an administrator. I have time to make complex edits from time to time, such as when I rewrote Ben's Personality section. I have also replaced all the templates on this wiki with flags pretty much single-handedly. But I can't make edits like that all the time, which is what I'm saying. That has nothing to do with being an administrator.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      And I was not trying to ignore your "physical pain", which seems little more than an eyesore for you.

      As someone who has a genetic predisposition to migraines, let me assure you, it's not.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      I was just saying that using your power to edit other people's posts, simply to change the color of a word that was used an as an example that only seems to bother you, seems rather like an abuse of power. Just saying.

      You'll notice how I asked, then calmly proceeded to explain multiple times what the issue was. You responded with disrespect and indifference.

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    • You told me many times why you don't have time. For the hundredth time, that doesn't make a difference.

      Oh, which answers did I ignore? Who tries manipulating here anybody? Administration is not that good. Plain and simple.

      "flat-out ignoring my physical pain" I'm sorry but this is hilarious. Like, it's just a color. You can mark the link using your mouse and the pain goes away.

      We are the only ones, mostly because I posted my first message 2 hours ago, not to mention that the thread was made a day ago and I think we both experienced how users like to be left out of the drama.

      You mean the two older users and two newbies? Hmmm... convincing.

      Everyone makes mistakes. Alright, it's not an excuse for everything.

      Have you ever thought about that we have personal problems with you as well? I mean you can say things I haven't heard from anyone before. (this is about chat, other users can't take your side on this)

      No one here is claiming anything infallible, but you. I'm just tired that all the answers I get is that "I have a life" and "people make mistakes."

      You don't have to be an admin to think of potential fixes and help solving problems.

      I've been discussing this issue with others, that's why we are here.

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:

      You told me many times why you don't have time. For the hundredth time, that doesn't make a difference.

      It does. You are under the impression that administrators have to do all the editing, as well as all the administrating, regardless of how many users we have. The fact is, when I don't have time to make complex edits, I do the work that other users can't - administrative work. Instead of complaining that admins don't do all the work on a wiki, why aren't you complaining that editors don't edit?

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Oh, which answers did I ignore?

      You ignored the fact that I disagreed with the way Superbike10's test was done. You ignored the fact that I didn't say the administrators didn't have any time whatsoever.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Who tries manipulating here anybody?

      ...What?

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Administration is not that good. Plain and simple.

      There are wikis where admins will block you for saying this, and I'm not even kidding.

      The administration isn't perfect. No administration is. But it is good. The fact this thread exists is proof of that. I heard there were issues other users had, so I gave them three potential ways to express themselves in: this thread, the chat, and our (admins') collective email address. I listened to your complaints and discussed the issues with Superbike10 (who was on the chat at the time). I have suggested improvements and am trying to come up with more improvements on the issues you've mentioned.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      "flat-out ignoring my physical pain" I'm sorry but this is hilarious. Like, it's just a color. You can mark the link using your mouse and the pain goes away.

      So much for empathy, I guess.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      We are the only ones, mostly because I posted my first message 2 hours ago, not to mention that the thread was made a day ago and I think we both experienced how users like to be left out of the drama.

      The drama only started when you lost your impartiality.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      You mean the two older users and two newbies? Hmmm... convincing.

      Why the sarcasm? Older users have been here longer than you, so they've experienced our administration longer than you. They are more experienced than you.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Everyone makes mistakes. Alright, it's not an excuse for everything.

      Indeed, it's not. If we were, for example, to delete an entire gallery worth of pictures for no reason, that would be inexcusable. If we miss a post that breaks the rules among thousands of edits, on the other hand, it is excusable.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Have you ever thought about that we have personal problems with you as well? I mean you can say things I haven't heard from anyone before. (this is about chat, other users can't take your side on this)

      I'm not the only one who can say whatever things you're talking about. I speak my mind within the scope of the rules.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      No one here is claiming anything infallible, but you. I'm just tired that all the answers I get is that "I have a life" and "people make mistakes."

      You sure act like we're claiming infallibility, by ignoring those two points - particularly the second one.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      You don't have to be an admin to think of potential fixes and help solving problems.

      True. What's your point?

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      I've been discussing this issue with others, that's why we are here.

      I'd like a word with and from these "others". I posted the admin email address, which virtually guarantees anonymity, yet nobody used it. I told users they could request a one-on-one chat with one or more admins of their choosing, yet nobody did so. This thread, which has been here for over 24 hours, garnered replies from six users, four of whom think the administration is good (but not perfect). Your claims don't match the evidence.

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    • I ignored the Superbike issue because I thought it was over. I don't need to react to your reaction. I pointed out that it happened.

      "You are under the impression that administrators have to do all the editing" No, just no. I complained enough about the users who don't edit, but it's not their job and I can live with that. I do the majority of the editing because I like doing it, so i don't get why you are under the impression that I think admins should do all the editing.

      "why aren't you complaining that editors don't edit?" That was my entire last year.

      My apologies about the manipulative part.

      "There are wikis where admins will block you for saying this, and I'm not even kidding." I'm not on any of those wikis, also there were two wikis when I said this, I was made an admin on both. Not saying that this is the natural outcome, but I don't see how this info is relevant.

      "So much for empathy, I guess." You made a scene and the fact that you used words like that made it even funnier and it sounded like coming from a robot. Ironically, they do not feel pain. Also, just mark the link and the color is gone.

      "The drama only started when you lost your impartiality." I never lost it, I have never been impartial about this issue.

      "They are more experienced than you." Wow, wow. Let's not make that jump. They registered sooner. Time doesn't equal experience. Especially, that this is about the later period of the wiki, when we were all around.

      "You sure act like we're claiming infallibility, by ignoring those two points - particularly the second one." My very fist question was; any plans of improving the administration?, not; any plans of taking the administration to the omniscient level? it's about time.


      So we have two regular users and two newbies who think that the administration is good and we have two custodian powerusers who think it's not all that. Good thing, it's not a vote.

      "Your claims don't match the evidence." Saying that they didn't notice anything wrong is not evidence, the things I said, are.

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    • I am one of the "others". I have heard some interesting comments from you, Blaziken, on chat, which have certainly made me... uncomfortable. They certainly weren't anything lewd in nature, they were just strange. I guess now I'll have to make sure I put my age on my wikia profile.

      I feel like I'm running into an issue I face a lot here based on what I'm reading. It partially feels like you're saying "I'm right because I'm older and therefore you are always wrong". I am honestly sick of hearing this. Are you implying that younger people cannot bring new ideas and opinions to the wiki? Because it certainly seems like it.

      I'd also like to point out that you happen to have what appears to be a God complex, which is never good for someone in power. If it wasn't obvious by your userpage, which gives you "Omnipotence, Omniscience, Immortality, and Invincibility", along with calling your species "One Above All".

      You also told me that ordinary users shouldn't be able to do things like add flags or purge pages, simply because it could cause vandalism, even though purging can simply be caused by editing a page and publishing it with no changes. Which is a form of purging. So in order to stop the "harmful" act of purging, you'd have to stop users from editing altogether. Hmm, sounds a little counterproductive there...

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    • Ylimegirl wrote:

      I am one of the "others".

      I guessed as much, but one person isn't "others", it's "other". I'm not saying these issues aren't real, but I am starting to think Oneofthosedf is trying to inflate the number of users by saying "others", even though only two have spoken up.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      I have heard some interesting comments from you, Blaziken, on chat, which have certainly made me... uncomfortable. They certainly weren't anything lewd in nature, they were just strange. I guess now I'll have to make sure I put my age on my wikia profile.

      As I explained, I didn't mean it to make you uncomfortable. I apologized. I meant it as a compliment, but, again, I'm sorry. If that's the nature of your personal problem with me, I can cease communicating with you entirely.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      I feel like I'm running into an issue I face a lot here based on what I'm reading. It partially feels like you're saying "I'm right because I'm older and therefore you are always wrong". I am honestly sick of hearing this. Are you implying that younger people cannot bring new ideas and opinions to the wiki? Because it certainly seems like it.

      Never thought that in my life. I experience that as well, and it makes me just as angry as it does you, maybe even more so. Many "young people" (mostly between 15 and 30), from my experience, are smarter than many "old people" (mostly between 40 and 80). However, "old people" don't recognize this, apparently believing that you acquire knowledge (or "wisdom") simply by becoming old.

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      I'd also like to point out that you happen to have what appears to be a God complex, which is never good for someone in power. If it wasn't obvious by your userpage, which gives you "Omnipotence, Omniscience, Immortality, and Invincibility", along with calling your species "One Above All".

      Disregarding the (bad) psychological profiling:

      Have I ever abused my power? Have I, for example, ignored reports that users were unhappy with the administration, blocking anyone who dares speak out? Have I defended my fellow admins' actions, even if I disagree with them? Have I blocked someone just because I felt like it?

      The answer to all of the above is a resounding "No".

      Ylimegirl wrote:

      You also told me that ordinary users shouldn't be able to do things like add flags or purge pages, simply because it could cause vandalism, even though purging can simply be caused by editing a page and publishing it with no changes. Which is a form of purging. So in order to stop the "harmful" act of purging, you'd have to stop users from editing altogether. Hmm, sounds a little counterproductive there...

      Hindsight is 20/20, as they say.

      I didn't know publishing a page without any changes purged it. I told you as much. I also note how you move from "could be harmful" to "is harmful", even though I only said the first, and only for specific pages (those that have content spanning more than one page). If you're going to tell a story, tell the whole story.

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    • "I am starting to think Oneofthosedf is trying to inflate the number of users by saying "others", even though only two have spoken up." I would never reveal the identities of the people who trusted me with their problems. It's absolutely their choice whether they speak up or not. Believe this or not, it doesn't make the problems go away or less real. I can tell you a number; it's 4 (which is a lot), just from recently. I don't keep a track on the ones that no longer matter.

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote: I ignored the Superbike issue because I thought it was over. I don't need to react to your reaction. I pointed out that it happened.

      The way you pointed it out implied that I agreed with what had been done, since you only quoted that part of my reply to you. Quote-mining is a very bad practice.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: No, just no. I complained enough about the users who don't edit, but it's not their job and I can live with that. I do the majority of the editing because I like doing it, so i don't get why you are under the impression that I think admins should do all the editing.

      For starters, because one of the complaints you (personally) have is that we don't always help you with editing.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: That was my entire last year.

      I don't recall that, but it was just a minor point, so I'll just end this topic here.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: My apologies about the manipulative part.

      I'm not sure if you're apologizing for your assumption or the incomprehensible English, the latter of which is what I was referring to.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: I'm not on any of those wikis, also there were two wikis when I said this, I was made an admin on both. Not saying that this is the natural outcome, but I don't see how this info is relevant.

      I expanded on that point beyond that.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: You made a scene and the fact that you used words like that made it even funnier and it sounded like coming from a robot. Ironically, they do not feel pain. Also, just mark the link and the color is gone.

      So I get complaints because I don't express emotion (trying to be professional), and I get indifference when I do express emotion. Gotcha.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: I never lost it, I have never been impartial about this issue.

      Get someone who is then.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: Wow, wow. Let's not make that jump. They registered sooner. Time doesn't equal experience. Especially, that this is about the later period of the wiki, when we were all around.

      Time does equal experience when you visit the wiki regularly, as those two do. I find it strange these problems only arose in the later period of the wiki, after you registered, but not before, when you claim to have visited and edited as an IP.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: My very fist question was; any plans of improving the administration?, not; any plans of taking the administration to the omniscient level? it's about time.

      I do have a plan. The first part involves getting a list of issues, which you have provided. The second part involves getting the current group of admins to improve on those issues. Should the second part fail, demotions (and promotions, if it is deemed necessary) will be made.

      Oneofthosedf wrote: Saying that they didn't notice anything wrong is not evidence, the things I said, are.

      Saying that two thirds of the users who posted here didn't have any complaints is evidence that the ones who have complaints aren't that many. This part wasn't about the problems you posted here, some (many?) of which I agree with. This was about the number of users who have issues with the administration.

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:

      I would never reveal the identities of the people who trusted me with their problems. It's absolutely their choice whether they speak up or not. Believe this or not, it doesn't make the problems go away or less real.

      More manipulative statements. I didn't ask you for identities. I didn't doubt these problems were real. I asked you for a number.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      I can tell you a number; it's 4 (which is a lot), just from recently. I don't keep a track on the ones that no longer matter.

      That's all you had to say.

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    • I actually had a problem, I am mostly on this wiki as a gallery filler, and you kinda mess up my edit with this. It was quite frustrating and I took a brake from the wiki, I was finished adding in every photo of the picture after I cleared the pagee. :/

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    • As I explained, at the time, I saw you had removed virtually every single image that was already there (for no reason, as far as I could tell) and only added about ten images. I thought you were spamming edits for badges, so I reverted it. I waited for you to notice my edit summary, but you just kept adding images, so I reverted them again and prepared a message for you. It was then you contacted me and I explained why I had reverted your edits. When you explained your side, I didn't edit that gallery again.

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    • Yeah, back then I didn't see you replied, so I thought you ignored it, that is why I brought it up here. Thanks for your answer though.

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    • Thanks for bringing it up.

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    • Blaziken rjcf wrote:
      Ylimegirl is right, Superbike10. You can't do something like that without community approval.

      Ylimegirl, I'm removing that example, if you wouldn't mind. That color hurts my eyes.


      Mine too.

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    • The admins not helping me when I ask is the only problem that only I had. I knew I shouldn't have brought it up.

      Actually, a lot of people say you sound like a robot and those are not even just the ones who complained. Also, some of your sentences are just unnecessarily long. For example, "I <filler word> fail to see the relevance of that" can be replaced with "I don't see the point". Again, this is something most people had problems with. Even I at the beginning. There is no need to answer this one, since these are just facts and I'm sure you heard them a lot.

      "I find it strange these problems only arose in the later period of the wiki, after you registered, but not before, when you claim to have visited and edited as an IP." So you do remember that. I hope you are not trying to say that the current situation would have never happened without me. This thread probably wouldn't exist, but I'm not responsible for anything the admins don't do. As for the IP part, I visited the wiki, but it is entirely different from that perspective. I think I may have edited twice or three times, maybe.

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    • Blaziken said before that is proffessionalism.

      http://ben10.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:180123

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    • Echoson wrote: Blaziken said before that is proffessionalism.

      http://ben10.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:180123

      The problem is not with the emotions. It's with pretentious sentences that some people don't understand. You can be professional with using shorter sentences.

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    • Well, you just used a word I did not understand till I Googled it, so shouldn't other people do that too? It is just the way he is used to write.

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:

      The admins not helping me when I ask is the only problem that only I had. I knew I shouldn't have brought it up.

      On the contrary. I have already discussed this issue with my fellow admins, and we'll try to do better.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      Actually, a lot of people say you sound like a robot and those are not even just the ones who complained. Also, some of your sentences are just unnecessarily long. For example, "I <filler word> fail to see the relevance of that" can be replaced with "I don't see the point". Again, this is something most people had problems with. Even I at the beginning. There is no need to answer this one, since these are just facts and I'm sure you heard them a lot.

      I haven't heard those a lot, actually. Not the "unnecessarily long sentences" part anyhow.

      That's the way I write, unfortunately. I'm not used to writing short sentences that can be easily misinterpreted, but rather state exactly what I mean, avoiding repetition. I suppose this stems from the fact that I'm a writer.

      Oneofthosedf wrote:

      I hope you are not trying to say that the current situation would have never happened without me.

      Not at all. What I meant doesn't matter anyhow.

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    • If only, when warning you would appericiate contributions, point out the violation/mistake and then warn would be better. Also, by not writing "and use common sense".

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    • I love the way blaziken writes but my friends however hate it and I call them immature.

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    • What do you mean by "appreciate contributions"? Also, I say "use common sense" because some things are just basic common sense, like insulting other users or writing opinions in articles.

      You have a point about posting a link to the rule violation. I'll do that from now on. Thank you.

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    • It was dedicated for new users that when they do something wrong, he/she should be appericiated that atleast h/s did something for wikia. Then it should be pointed out that there was a mistake and then h/s be warned. (Not necesary for second warning)

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    • Hey guys.  I used to be a past bureaucrat (as the admins probably know).  I'd like to put in my honest input on this admin issue that would definitely, in my opinion, benefit the entire wiki.  

      One of the most important things that hones the development of any wiki is a sense of community.  Unfortunately, BTP lacks that component greatly.  Being a member of Wikia for about 4 and a half years, I've more than noticed that the key thing that keeps bigger wikis thriving is their entire community and how they work together.  Both non-admins and administrators lack this.  I feel as though almost the entire administration acts more as a police force rather than a team of staff.  One of the bigger things happening on this wiki that contributes to my idea is the warning system.  While the warning system this wiki imposes is more than sufficient to notify users of their mistakes, I believe something lighter such as a simple reminder would do the job just as well along with reinforcing good wiki values much more positively.  Of course, notifying a user of their potential of being blocked if they continue to do what they do should still keep on going.  However, I've seen way too many messages titled, "Warning."  The word itself has a hugely negative connotation to it and might have contributed to the entire sense of community that this wiki used to have, to some degree.  This is one of the many things that could be improved on.  Of course, the administration have done a great job in terms of policy keeping and content building, but this community is really no community at all.  The administration and the wiki may disagree with this post, but it's actually one of  the most crucial components to keeping any organization great.  Without it, this wiki cannot run smoothly.  

      Like Blaze said, the administration's job is to keep this wiki run efficiently and smoothly.  The efficient part has definitely been accomplished, but there's still a long way to go on the "smoothly" part.  Believe it or not, building up a community and acting as friendly staffers rather than sturdy police officers is a part of the position an admin holds.  

      I know I am not an active member here anymore, but I still see things that really should be changed.  I want this wiki to flourish as much as everyone else does.  Thanks for reading and I hope everyone takes this into consideration.  

      PS: Great job with everything else.  :)

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    • I agree that the admins act more like a police force than friendly help. When I first joined, I was scared to edit sometimes due to the warning system being so strict. Not to mention the way they are word out.

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    • Unless I'm giving a user a last warning, all warnings are worded in a neutral manner. How would you word a warning to someone who's doing something they shouldn't be doing in a friendly way?

      As for being strict, one of the complaints in this thread is the exact opposite - some vandals aren't blocked soon enough. What exactly do you propose?

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    • I don't have long to stay on here but I just wanted to come by and quickly say that my issue with administration is that there is only one admin who really does everything around here, and thats Blaziken. Superbike10 sometimes helps but that doesn't really cut it, we need more admins getting involved with what's happenening on the wiki. To help warn/block vandals to delete unacceptable images and pages etc.

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    • I just want to point out that we (admins) have discussed every issue posted here thus far, with the exception of Echoson's latest post. Solutions have been proposed and, hopefully, these problems will go away.

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    • So I just found this page: Template:Administrators. This will be more of a question/observation than another issue. Is this how things are supposed to be or it is because the Avatar wiki had it? (This is a serious question by the way.) Because, this makes me realize something.

      • Blaziken has been doing what he was supposed to.
      • Cokedragon's inactivity seems to be perfectly OK, although he is supposed to take care of rules, counter-vandalism and suggestions.
      • So Linkmadara just shares news? I mean he uploads good images but I never seen news shared by him since I've been here.
      • Superbike has been doing what he was supposed to.
      • Tenbennyson is sort of inactive, he makes 2-3 edits monthly in average but this explains the former lack in the content department. I mean he is in the CotG now, but it's no different with him than it was with Cokedragon.

      Again, this is just my observation. I saw that you discussed things but I'm curious about that.

      PS: Maybe I only posted this because for the template's color.

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    • You'd have to ask PlasmaBot why he created the template, because I don't remember. Personally, I think it's only useful to show who's active and who's not, seeing as how my idea to separate admin responsibilities on the wiki was rejected (mainly by PlasmaBot himself, which makes the existence of that template all the more confusing). You might also want to notice that template hadn't been edited in a while. I didn't even remember it existed until Tenbennyson edited it.

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    • I did notice that, that's why I asked it. I naturally assumed that in a creation of a page like this, all admin would be involved.

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    • I don't remember.

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    • I'd like to explain what happened in the case where I supposedly "spammed for badges". First off, since most of you are new here, you probably don't know that I always had the habit of going on binge edits. Whenever I get time and am in the mood, I go around the wiki doing as much editing as I can.

      I honestly don't have much knowledge of templates, and did not know it was possible to link galleries via templates, which was later done by Oneofthosedf. Anyway, this was just another case of me binge editing, and I assure you, it was not a case of me trying to earn badges. Think about it, after more than three years of dedication to the wiki, why would I randomly decide I want to earn badges, of all things, when I already have the rank of administrator. If I wanted badges, I would have started spamming a long time ago.

      If it seemed that way however, I sincerely apologize to all the users.

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    • If you still want to binge edit, I have a couple of no-brainers for you.

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    • I'd say my initial experience was a combonation of both my mistakes as well as yours because I didn't understand a lot of things I did wrong in the beginning but, learned yet felt when I tried to turn it around that because of my early mistakes I was scared forever on this wiki to the point where ever I tried to do something good or right it would be reverted just because I did it. So better communication between users and admins is essenstial.

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    • Yeah. I know that I'm not really active on this wiki... but I can agree that there are some problems.

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    • This is about the Spell list. So far the only people who didn't answer to the message on their walls were admins. See, I don't know if they told Blaziken whether they support it or not, but I have to assume they did not, since then we would have all the answers we need. These were asked 3 days ago, you have all been here and if you told your answer to Blaziken I assume, he would have let me know what's up. Either way, I never imagined that the problem with this method would be with the admins.

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    • ...Or, you know, we got so caught up in discussing the issues posted on this thread that we forgot to talk about that.

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    • Hey guys.  Sorry, there were some misconceptions and mistakes on my part.  I haven't been active here much, as I've already stated, and I definitely screwed up writing my post in a little part.  However, the general message is still there.  My opinion on the warning system is definitely liberal, but it'll hopefully work.  Let me further explain.  I understand the whole neutral theme that some of the admins want to put on, but it's not very welcoming.  Perhaps instead of titling a thread, "Warning" -  maybe titling a message with something less negatively explicit?  I know you guys want to get your point across, but something simple as "Reminder" would be a lot more welcoming.  Simple things make huge changes.  Moreover, having something like an exclamation mark to express friendliness would be awesome.  I know I sound like I'm some roses and bunnies guy, but it really could stop you from hitting the block button.  What I mean is that positive reminders can change "rule breakers" and make them into potentially awesome editors of the wiki.  Also, maybe holding some wiki events could bring a great team spirit together.  


      Before you guys give me a justification or some sort of reason why the warning reason is sufficient as it is, please at least take it into consideration.  One huge thing:  The warning system is just one very little suggestion I made.  No need to create some sort of unncessary debate about it, like there have been with other small topics.  My whole point is that this wiki lacks community and perhaps it's time for the admins to start trying to build it up.  Problems like this will definitely be easier and more avoidable in the future if you build up the necessary community.

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    • I'm not an admin but anyone can give warnings as long as they are appropriate.

      Well, we don't put "Warning" in the titles anymore, we just have the "Episode titles are italic" or "Refrain from voting/editing". Also, how can the exclamation mark express friendliness?

      I don't want to start a debate either but have you seen the warnings that were recently given? They are not nearly as bad as they used to be.

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    • First of all I am a poweruser so yeah, let's get the debate started.

      Oneofthosedf, many of your arguments seem invalid to me. You think you are supreme and that you can talk in any way you want. You are wrong. While you have served the wiki well, you have an inflated sense and you think you are No.1 just because of some stupid rankings. Blaze has served more than you did and he is not arrogant or obnoxious about it. 

      YlimeGirl, I never thought of you as rude untill I saw this thread. You seem to hate Blaze. Though I do not want to get to an argument with you as you are also an helpful custodian and you are not arrogant.

      Blaze, I have no problems with you but I have problems with other admins/Bureaucats. First of all, Superbike10. He didn't seem to know the new voting system and he had to be warned by a Vandal. Next up is TenBennyson, he is spamming and he is not contributing in any way. Linkmadra and Costas3 and CokeDragon are useless as well. So the problem lies not with u but the other admins/Bureaucats. You should get them demoted and you should put Ben10Fan3 or Feedback100 in the case who are more reliable. I know Linkmadra and Superbike10 have been here for a long time but they are not the least helpful.

      I am not offending anyone. I am just voicing out my opinions.

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    • Ylimegirl has the right to be upset. It's my fault.

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    • Ok. But still many users hate you because you block them. This is wrong. You are just doing your job.

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    • Also, Tenbennyson already explained what he did. It doesn't even make sense to consider he was spamming edits for badges when he's already in the second most powerful position on the wiki.

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      1. There is a reason poweruser is not an actual rank. It's just there to give people motivation. I can spam messages all over my wall without doing anything else, and I would still become a poweruser.
      2. Invalid to you. No, I don't think I'm supreme and can talk in any way I want. For example, I never used profanity or even thought of it and I never called any users stupid (mostly, because I don't find any users stupid). Did people tell me I sounded rude? Yeah. Can we rely on that? No, as you just called Ylimegirl rude.
      3. This inflated sense part is familiar. At least you didn't say that if I didn't join the wiki, someone would have came along and do what I did.
      4. I am number one on the leaderboard for multiple reasons. In the last three weeks I uploaded over 17,000 images. A lot more before that. I have over 34,000 edits. I have over 69,000 contributions, while the second best doesn't even have 40,000. So, yeah, I wouldn't call these rankings stupid
      5. It's probably about your edit spamming and me not greenlighting you to vote. Just for the record, you were one of them who they complained about. I'm actually surprised why you are still bothering me about that after I told you that you didn't have enough quality edits. Ask Blaziken if you meet his requirements, those are for users like you after all. (I'm not being offensive but it is the truth.)
      6. As someone who heard these things from Ylimegirl when they happened, I can say she has all the right to be rude, yet she is still not rude. She is just voicing her opinions.
      7. As much as I would love to write something for the last part, there isn't really much new to say about it. You basically said what others but in a much more straight-forward and radical way.
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    • But what about the others?

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    • Oneofthosedf wrote:
      #There is a reason poweruser is not an actual rank. It's just there to give people motivation. I can spam messages all over my wall without doing anything else, and I would still become a poweruser.
      1. Invalid to you. No, I don't think I'm supreme and can talk in any way I want. For example, I never used profanity or even thought of it and I never called any users stupid (mostly, because I don't find any users stupid). Did people tell me I sounded rude? Yeah. Can we rely on that? No, as you just called Ylimegirl rude.
      2. This inflated sense part is familiar. At least you didn't say that if I didn't join the wiki, someone would have came along and do what I did.
      3. I am number one on the leaderboard for multiple reasons. In the last three weeks I uploaded over 17,000 images. A lot more before that. I have over 34,000 edits. I have over 69,000 contributions, while the second best doesn't even have 40,000. So, yeah, I wouldn't call these rankings stupid
      4. It's probably about your edit spamming and me not greenlighting you to vote. Just for the record, you were one of them who they complained about. I'm actually surprised why you are still bothering me about that after I told you that you didn't have enough quality edits. Ask Blaziken if you meet his requirements, those are for users like you after all. (I'm not being offensive but it is the truth.)
      5. As someone who heard these things from Ylimegirl when they happened, I can say she has all the right to be rude, yet she is still not rude. She is just voicing her opinions.
      6. As much as I would love to write something for the last part, there isn't really much new to say about it. You basically said what others but in a much more straight-forward and radical way.


      2. You are flaming Blaze for what he wrote on your wall.

      3. The second best is busy these days. Also I am not denying the fact that you helped alot. I am just saying you are arrogant. I did not call you rude. 

      4. You are not telling me the required quality and mainspace edits . You took the responsibilty you shall do it.

      5. I am sorry about that. I was mistaken. Sorry YlimeGirl.

      6. You are now indirectly flaming me.

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    • 2. I wouldn't call that flaming, since as I know him, he probably still thinks that. Although, it's ridiculous.

      3. He is busy for more than a year but that has nothing to do with the main point. Please explain how I'm arrogant, maybe I can change.

      4. At this very moment I am counting your edits but I'll let this one slide because you haven't responded to that yet.

      6. I can see your points. We could even say I agree with them up to a point. But unlike us, you just told Blaziken that all the other admins are useless and should get demoted. That's radical and no one did that so far.

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    • 4. Answer it in my wall.

      3. You act like you own this wiki. Your arrogance has improved ever since that warning. Before that you considered me like some rotten apple.

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    • 6. I know them for some time. They sometimes help or helped. Are you telling me that or stating that? Cause I never tried to become an admin. Custodians work a lot more nowadays, I rather get associated with that group. Haha.

      4. Same for you.

      3. I don't think so. I think that happens when you are number 1 and do everything for the better of the wiki. Fun fact: all of my suggestions have been approved and every single thing Blaziken warned me about or told me it was bad or useless turned out to be good and liked by the users. Most of the people who tell this to me tell me because I brought a lot of changes.

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    • Calm down, DF and BenBFF. Just calm down before this becomes a flame war.

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    • Thank you, Monitor071.

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    • Hey, sorry if I'm reopening up a somewhat closed discussion.  I guess the warning system is perfectly fine as it is.  However, community building should be a priority as of now.  Thank you Blaze and all the other admins for making this wiki run smoothly.  It's good to see the wiki grow into a stable shape.

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    • PlasmaBot wrote:
      Hey, sorry if I'm reopening up a somewhat closed discussion.  I guess the warning system is perfectly fine as it is.  However, community building should be a priority as of now.  Thank you Blaze and all the other admins for making this wiki run smoothly.  It's good to see the wiki grow into a stable shape.

      I don't believe that this dicussion was only about the warning system, Plasma. And I agree. This wiki is "evolving".

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    • But many admins are devolving.

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    • BenBFF wrote:
      But many admins are devolving.

      Tell me. How does that make any sense? 

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    • Monitor071 wrote:
      BenBFF wrote:
      But many admins are devolving.
      Tell me. How does that make any sense? 


      Do I know you? Because you are chasing me all around and you are indirectly flaming me. I mean to say that excluding Blaze all other admins/Burueacats were great contributors to this wiki. But now they don't do a single thing and are useless and they should be demoted.

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    • A FANDOM user
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