Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26200221-20151211162449/@comment-25752292-20160121034724

Kevfilms2x2 wrote: Here's what I think shouldn't be included in the reboot. (His whole argument that is above a few messages on this forum.)

This is gonna be kinda long, so I apologize. And to the comment author, I also want to apologize if it looks like I'm criticizing your whole argument. Just to make it clear, I agree with a lot of what you said, but I feel like we should discuss some other things more in-depth and look at different sides of the issue, or at least keep the discussion going.

Anyways, you started off with the topic of Kevin being a hero being terrible. While I personally liked Kevin as a hero, I respect your opinion, and while I never thought of it that way before today, I can now agree that his switch to being a hero was definitely REALLY rushed. I like Stryzzar's idea of how to better integrate Kevin into the hero's team. While Kevin's integration was definitely kinda crappy, I feel like Kevin himself in AF was a great character. Yes, he definitely broke the continuity, and UA somewhat tried to fix that, but I'll be honest, I liked the broken continuity of AF and UA WAY more than the broken continuity in OV. OV just took away the creativity and vastness of the original Ben 10 backstories and replaced it with... mutants? Kevin had no need to be connected to the Plumber's Helpers, same for Argit. They tried too hard to interconnect everyone's story and failed. It's an Omniverse. They should have understood that not everyone has to know everyone.

About Gwevin, while it was definitely terrible in UA, I liked it in AF. Wasn't that bad or anything. However, I couldn't possibly agree more with your idea about less romance. Since this is a show about a 10-year old, we need zero romance, and even if he was a teen, romance should be at a absolute minimum. The Ben 10 franchise has proved time and time again that they can achieve every problem ever conceivable with a fictional romance without actually getting any romance right.

This is another thing that is just me. I liked Ben 10 way better when it was in AF focusing on the sci-fi aspects. I liked the aliens a lot more than the magic stuff. Probably because aliens we can understand, magic we can't. I know that's exactly what makes it so great for some viewers, but for me at least, I liked their focus on aliens a lot. OV however didn't mess things up too much by also focusing on magic. Pulling off an OV balance would be great, you're right.

I'll be honest. UA was definitely pretty bad by the end, and we all knew OV was going to be bad. It was expected that it wouldn't be able to recover from UA. It did a great job, but it obviously took a steep drive. The only thing is, the storylines in UA, while terrible, were a lot better than most things in OV. And the romances in OV are worse than anything you could find in UA. Ok, maybe they were equally bad. But I'd put OV as a terrible show for a variety of reasons, besides just atrocious artwork.

And on the subject of artwork, I can agree that OV definitely improved a lot of aliens, but any alien it didn't improve it made so horrible that nothing in the franchise looked worse. The reason I'm so biased is because Chromastone was my favorite alien... and well... we saw what happened to him in that last episode.

About dumbing down the villains, YES. YOU UNDERSTAND PERFECTLY. It was so stupid to watch Vilgax be so stupid. He was pathetic in OV, and he was pretty dumb in UA. And Albedo was pretty much ruined in OV. Honestly, every major Ben 10 villain was ruined in OV.

Aggregor being arrested, I'm pretty sure, was explained as being because of his murder of five aliens, hijacking a Plumber ship, and murdering a Plumber official. And the Vilgax returning to Earth plot hole is pretty major, good job for spotting it!

I kind of liked the whole adding a Plumber base they did. Sure, it messed with the continuity, but it was nice to have more Plumbers. Gave a very MIB feel to the whole thing.

Ok this one is fully opinion, but AF had the BEST aliens of ANY Ben 10 show. I have no problem with any alien on that show, except maybe Spidermonkey (always the odd one out). Sure, many weren't that original, but they were all still way cooler than the guys they replaced. UA on the other hand had kinda dumb aliens (besides the Andromeda Five, those guys were epic, even Terraspin). Fasttrack is still the only alien who I consider absolutely unnecessary, so yeah, that's pretty bad for UA. And the other four were kind of stupid too. In case anyone wants to reference them, those four were Jury Rigg, Clockwork, ChamAlien, and Eatle. I may have forgotten one, so feel free to correct me.

While original aliens are epic (Most of OV's aliens were AWESOME, but not the level of AF), some aliens are pretty cool even if they're similar to other aliens. Don't forget, Martian Manhunter has a huge fan following even though he's Superman from Mars (but with EXTRA powers). And when it comes to copies, aliens like Swampfire and Echo Echo are still pretty dang creative.

Definitely a balance on action and comedy. I don't want OV, I don't want UA. Honestly, even AF is probably a bad idea. The OS perfectly captured the spirit of Ben 10 that made the franchise so popular, and it's sad that theynever bothered to reproduce those results again.

About the likable characters and Ben's maturity thing, I literally said the same things to friends on a different website a few months ago. It looks like great minds think alike my friend. ;)

And like I said earlier, I definitely agree about the bad romance thing. We really don't need a "Catch A Falling Star" again, or whatever that Charmcaster/Darkstar episode was (shudders). Even that gameshow episode was a mockery of the Ben 10 franchise and all it stood for.

I won't really comment on the art style because I'm no expert on that, and my two cents probably won't be much help anyways.